On today’s episode, Apollo sits down with Danielle Shoots, Managing Partner and Director of the New Community Transformation Fund - Denver. With the mission of providing equity for BIPOC founders, Danielle shares her point of view as a young pioneer in the world of philanthropy.
On today’s episode, Apollo sits down with Danielle Shoots, Managing Partner and Director of the New Community Transformation Fund - Denver. With the mission of providing equity for BIPOC founders, Danielle is a pioneer in the world of philanthropy at the age of 26.
Scoring highest in Prioritize and Leverage, Danielle dives into how she’s hacked her career at an early age. She shares perspective on how she was able to team-build and influence others even in performance based roles, and how she’s on a mission to crack open the venture capital industry, and how marginalized communities in the US should be treated as a domestic emerging market.
Valuing impact-oriented goals over routine tasks, Apollo and Danielle discuss a shift in thought leadership through the generations. citing the internet and play-dates as cultural markers that note a change in what is demanded of professional leaders.
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Guest Bio
Danielle Shoots is the Managing Partner and Managing Director of the New Community Transformation fund – Denver, an equity venture capital fund for BIPOC founders and the President and CEO of Wealth Equity Enterprises, a holdings company that owns several businesses that support the mission of building BIPOC wealth and leadership. Born and raised in Colorado, Danielle is a graduate of the University of Colorado at Denver, where she earned a degree in Business Administration.
At the age of 26, Danielle embarked on her executive leadership path ascending to the position of Chief Financial Officer (CFO) for the Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment. After the state, Danielle served as the Vice President of Finance and Business Operations for the West Division of Comcast, managing a billion-dollar capital portfolio, strategic FP&A, Mergers and Acquisitions and a team of sixty employees located in seven states. Most recently Danielle, was the Chief Financial Officer for the Colorado Trust where she grew the foundation’s endowment from $430 million to nearly $600 million, reduced cash on hand to a recurring 1% while still operating the foundation. She also launched a direct investment portfolio across the State making investments in local media companies, real estate and housing and small businesses and leveraging the endowments’ balance sheet for creative bridge financing across multiple sectors and industries.
Danielle’s passion for people and leadership, distinguished business acumen and tenacious work ethic have garnered her numerous accolades, including inclusion on the prestigious 2019 list of the Top 25 Most Powerful Women in Business from the Colorado Women’s Chamber of Commerce, The 2020 Emerging Leader in Philanthropy from ABFE, The 2018 Woman of the Year Award for her work with youth in the community, and a recipient of the 2017 Denver Business Journal’s 40 Under 40 award.
Danielle is a passionate community member and serves as a trustee for the Women’s Foundation, a mayoral appointed board member for the Prosper Denver Fund and the chief economic equity advisor to State Senator, James Coleman and State Representative, Leslie Harod.
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Guest PLE Score
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Guest Quote
”The one thing I did was I cut a big check, and hired a second Managing Director immediately. It forced me to be really creative, and it forced me to put my money where my mouth was around us being a fund, that was going to really get to know our portfolio companies and our investments, and really be a partner with them.
And then, I hired my Chief of Staff right away too, because she's my executor. So it was just a matter of saying, "I know what I'm good at, what I'm not good at. I'd rather have the pressure of making sure their payroll hits every month than the pressure of trying to execute all the details of building this fund by myself." -Danielle Shoots
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Time Stamps
*(2:47) Intro
*(4:15) Danielle’s Achievement Index
*(6:04) Rising quickly through the “execute” phase of her career
*(10:28) Valuing impact as a millennial
*(14:10) How Apollo and Danielle met, and her mission to fund in Denver
*(17:49) Treating underfunded communites as emerging markets
*(29:46) Becoming a reformed “people-pleaser”
*(31:15) Danielle’s hiring process
*(36:33) Mentoring the business’s you fund
*(39:25) Making capitalism work for marginalized communities
*(47:19) Apollo’s Takeaway’s
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Links
[00:00:00] Apollo: Improving your leadership skills will help you in every area of your life. But it's tough to know where to get started, and that's why we created the Achievement Index Assessment. You can take the assessment@theachievementindex.com. It takes about five minutes, and it's gonna generate a personalized report that breaks down how you prioritize, leverage and execute.
[00:00:19] Apollo: Go to the achievement index.com or find the link in the show
[00:00:23] Danielle: notes. Nothing I do is sustainable because I know myself, so I've got a few years of runway. I'll build the thing and then I will bring in people to turn the wheel of this thing that's already working, because it'll be time for me to tackle the next thing that's on fire like I'm a firefighter.
[00:00:40] Danielle: I think that's the title I'd give myself. And so it's like, all right, what's the next fire? What's the next way to bend this system towards justice? What policy work needs to happen? And I'll do that.
[00:00:52] Apollo: Welcome to the Achievement Index, a podcast designed to help you understand and accelerate the ways you perform.
[00:01:01] Apollo: I'm Dr. Apollo cca. I created the Achievement Index based on my experience in the F B I US Army Special Forces. And business according to the achievement index. Vibrant success is the result of doing well in three areas, or as we like to call them, orientations, prioritize, leverage, and execute. On this podcast, I'll be getting inside the minds of noteworthy leaders to explore how their unique orientations inform the successes and challenges they've navigated throughout their lives and careers.
[00:01:35] Apollo: Joining me today is Danielle Schutz, managing partner and managing director of the New Community Transformation Fund Denver, an equity venture capital fund for Bipo founders. She's also the president and c E O of Wealthy Equity Enterprises, a holding company that owns several businesses which support the mission of building Bipo wealth and leadership.
[00:01:56] Apollo: Danielle began her executive leadership path early ascending to the position of C F O for the Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment at just 26. 26. Y'all. Since then, she's served as the VP of Finance and business operations for the West Division of Comcast, managing a billion dollar capital portfolio.
[00:02:16] Apollo: Most recently, Danielle was the Chief Financial Officer for the Colorado Trust where she grew the foundation endowment from $430 million to nearly 600 million reduced cash on hand to a recurring 1% while still operating the foundation. Danielle made the 2019 list of the top 25 most powerful women in business from the Colorado Women's Chamber of Commerce and was awarded the 2020.
[00:02:43] Apollo: Emerging leader in philanthropy from A B F E. Danielle, how in the world are you doing today?
[00:02:51] Danielle: I'm doing pretty good. How are you?
[00:02:53] Apollo: Amazing. You've clearly done a lot, and we're gonna dive into a fraction of that here today. So the way that this usually works is it's a conversation where we're looking at the amazing things that you have accomplished through the lens of this.
[00:03:06] Apollo: Prioritize, leverage. Execute framework, and I do see that you took the assessment. Mm-hmm. Um, you are 56% prioritize, 40% leverage, and 1%. Execute. This is great because I have not, uh, encountered somebody who has less execute than I do. I'm 8% execute and you're 4% execute. And you know, a lot of the guests on this show are because it's normal for, and even necessary for executive leaders and folks who are responsible for a bunch of stuff to be prioritizers.
[00:03:44] Apollo: But you know, there's always a question of, okay, well as you're prioritizing and leveraging, With so little execute, um, in your responses, how have you managed to get anything done? You know, what are your reactions to seeing these scores?
[00:03:59] Danielle: Yeah, they seem like dead on the money. I love a good, I love a good assessment, so I, you know, I think even, you know, even before.
[00:04:08] Danielle: I was an executive. I have been most of my career, so you can imagine what that does to an execute theme for me. Mm-hmm. Um, is that, that isn't been the way that I've had to get things done in my career. But I think if you think about how do I execute, it's through people. So that's where that leverage comes in.
[00:04:22] Danielle: So I make sure that I, I. Really surround myself with phenomenal executors. And that's sort of been the way I've been successful in my career. And not that it's a strength of mine, even if I needed to do more of it, that's probably why I naturally became a leader pretty quick is 'cause that's actually low.
[00:04:39] Danielle: Oh, that's so interest. Even in my natural,
[00:04:40] Apollo: organic way. That's so interesting. So you're saying like, Because you know, for a lot of folks they're like, yeah, I was, I was an executor, I was a lawyer or an investment banker, and I spent three to five years grinding it out. One of our other guests, uh, chin and Ecwa said, I learned how the sausage was made, but you know, like once you see something once or twice as an executor, then you can move up.
[00:05:02] Apollo: But that, that wasn't really your experience. So you were c f oing it by 26. Right. So did you have a kind of execute period in your career, or what did that look like? A really
[00:05:11] Danielle: short one, so, so as a financial analyst coming outta college. Um, so I think, you know, between 22 and 26, I was an individual contributor, but I think even the way I get work done is to start really high and I only cut down into the detail if I need it.
[00:05:29] Danielle: I can't, I can go deep into the detail. Mm-hmm. But I, I only do it if I can't solve the problem at a high level. That's sort of the way my brain works, is to just cut into the layers versus to build up. And so I think I. Approached my work even as an individual contributor that way, which is probably an accelerator to my career, right?
[00:05:47] Danielle: So I think they always saw me as a financial strategist even more than, I'm a horrible accountant. I'm not an accountant, so I've always had to be surrounded by great detail people. When it comes to accounting and sort of how to build numbers up from the minute to the big, I go from the big to the little, and I think I've always been like that.
[00:06:05] Danielle: I don't, I think it, it's been reinforced, but I think that's my organic way. I like, I could probably point to grade school and, and I was that way.
[00:06:14] Apollo: Hmm. I'm sure for the folks who are younger in their career that they love to hear that like, oh, sweet, yeah, let me just go ahead and skip this individual contributor thing and be a boss.
[00:06:25] Apollo: Um, yeah. But you know, I think a lot of times when organizations hire individual contributors, they're looking for. Executors, right? They're looking for, for tacticians. They're not like, oh, let me go hire an entry-level person so that way I can figure out what they think we should do. Right? Like, did you ever meet any friction in your career and how did you navigate and balance that?
[00:06:45] Danielle: Yeah, I met a lot of friction, but I, um, I. I save people a lot of money and I get a lot of things done. So I think it's interesting when you think about, uh, the word execute, but my ability to sort of influence a team, even before I had a, a team on an org chart was always there, sort of this collaborative nature in which I, I thought about getting things done and I know how to do everything if I had to.
[00:07:07] Danielle: And I think that's important, right? Like, I think. That, whether or not I had to execute things myself is one thing. Do I know how to execute them? Yeah. Do I learn everybody's job and what's good about it, what they like about it, what they're good at? Like, that's where you'll see even the 4% show up is, um, sort of the detail in which the way people get things done.
[00:07:27] Danielle: And I think I've, I've just always been that way even before someone told me I could on an org chart and, and so of course that's met with friction and I was really young and even when I had an org chart, My way of being in the world was met with friction. We live in a society where it is, where it was.
[00:07:42] Danielle: It's shifted, but very much individual contributor. And you know, what did you check off your list today? And I actually think that's the hardest part about people transitioning into leadership is how do you. Say I was successful today without the checklist of what did I actually do? Yeah. Versus who did I do it through?
[00:08:03] Apollo: Woo. We're only five minutes into this conversation and there's already so much to unpack, but one of the big things that jumped out at me is that. Danielle has always known that she is a prioritizer. She's an executive and has been since the day she started working, but she started out in individual contributor roles, so she had to learn how to do all the things.
[00:08:27] Apollo: She had to learn how to execute. She had to learn how to check everything off of a checklist because. That's what the world expected of her as an individual contributor. But she thinks that the world is shifting away from valuing checklists and more so valuing impact, and I'm really curious to see why she thinks that is.
[00:08:49] Danielle: Yeah, I have so many theories about it. I'm like, I could just do that for a living and study it. I would, I think like my first TED Talk, I talk a little bit about that. I think millennials and sort of the technology and the way it's shaped. The way we work was sort of the beginning of this. Yeah.
[00:09:03] Apollo: You heard it right?
[00:09:03] Apollo: She said her first TED Talk. Okay. She's got like an anthology. Okay. So just check out all the stuff that she's saying right now. Only applies to her first one. Okay. Alright. Okay. Please
[00:09:14] Danielle: continue. Exactly. It's a theme throughout. I think about like the way work is. Changing the way the market's changing as a result of the way generations are changing and becoming more diverse in the way that they do things.
[00:09:28] Danielle: And I think I have a lot of theories. I think technology is a huge one, and, and the way we get things done is different. Mm, mm-hmm. The way we execute is different. And that was the first generation to be raised sort of fundamentally with technology in that way. Like, I can just go get an answer to my question in a very different way than.
[00:09:45] Danielle: 50 years ago in the workforce, and that changes the way people execute. I think it's the generation of play dates, and so I think that's something to think about, right? In the way that that shows up in work. It's that everything is, you know, Together and we did things together. Mm-hmm. And not play time.
[00:10:01] Danielle: Mm-hmm. But play date, right? Mm-hmm. Like that's when that language came into effect is with the millennials and just all kinds of things like that, that it's like it, they're seen as anti collaborative, but it's actually like the most collaborative, the most diverse generation. Um, and then every generation from there will get more and more diverse.
[00:10:17] Danielle: And I think that's a big part of what's changing. In work where people have a lot less sort of patience for waiting their turn. Mm-hmm. And money isn't t a driver in the same way. Yeah. In the workforce as it used to be, to be It's an expensive world. The US is an expensive place and it changes people's relationship with money.
[00:10:37] Danielle: Yeah. And how much they make and whether or not they're willing to be miserable to make it. And so I think all that is shifting for us.
[00:10:44] Apollo: Okay, so I have to, for our listeners, I have to tell you how we met. So I was on LinkedIn. LinkedIn, for those of you who don't know is like my TikTok. Okay. So I was on LinkedIn and I saw this article about this phenomenal woman who was, uh, raising a $50 million fund out in Colorado to support Bipo entrepreneurs and and founders.
[00:11:05] Apollo: And I was like, oh my gosh. Doing some really cool work out there. And so I sent a connection request to Danielle and she connected and I was like, Hey, we should talk some time. I love the work that you're doing. And I was like, cool. And so we hopped on Zoom probably, I don't know, six weeks later or something like that.
[00:11:19] Apollo: Talked for like 24 minutes before both of us had to jump, but instantaneously we were like, oh, we are, we are each other's people like, that's right. Um, and so I hopped on a plane and we spent the day talking about, yeah, everything from fun structures to politics to the types of things that we're already into here.
[00:11:44] Apollo: So, uh,
[00:11:45] Danielle: yeah, it's so great, so much. The universe has done that for me since I started this fund. I appreciate it.
[00:11:50] Apollo: Yeah. So let's, let's talk about the fund and again, like this, prioritize, leverage, execute formula here because, you know, You're raising in a state that is not known for its bipo founders. Right?
[00:12:03] Apollo: It's first. I mean, I know lots of places are kind of budding in the investment and technology space, but if you think about Colorado, it's not exactly where you would say, oh yeah, I bet you we can find a bunch of black and brown founders over there. Plus moving into this kind of, Pencils down environment with investors where there's a lot of people kind of sitting and waiting and watching to see what happens with interest rates and, and markets and the economy in general.
[00:12:27] Apollo: So, you know, can you talk a little bit about this journey and this, this fundraise?
[00:12:33] Danielle: Yeah, I think, you know, Colorado isn't the most diverse place. It's a lot of things, but I do call Denver the big little city. And I, I, I grew up here, I grew my career here, and I think you can't underestimate the social capital game behind investing and raising funds.
[00:12:49] Danielle: And I, I was a part of this ecosystem. I was doing this work that was thinking about the economy, both at a micro level in Denver and a macro level in the us And I'd been doing a ton of work on, um, What I call, like, I call it race omics, which is sort of behavioral economics. Mm-hmm. And how sort of the demography and how things have changed in the country in a way that you can really think about the market differently and predict market outcomes as a result of just.
[00:13:16] Danielle: Demography in the country. And so we were doing a lot of that work and just realized we didn't have a fund like this. We didn't have an equity vehicle, not that venture needed to be the deal. It needed to be equity where people were taking an equity stake. I have a vested interest in making sure your company grows in scales for founders, and we have amazing founders here.
[00:13:35] Danielle: We have amazing founders who are willing to be here in order to have an investor that looks like them. And so there's sort of an underestimation of what I call the domestic emerging market, and they're in every city, in every city. State, and if you can find someone that really knows how that market moves within the state, I think you can have an easier time raising a fund.
[00:13:54] Danielle: I don't think the coast set the market. I think the market should set the asset class in the way that it's changing now. And so, um, I think that's what we're doing. In Colorado, and I've just been really fortunate to have institutions get behind me, which is really rare in a first time fund. Certainly a first time fund run by a black woman.
[00:14:12] Danielle: So, um, you know, usually folks have to get that $50,000 at a time, and our average LP size is $4 million so far, so,
[00:14:22] Apollo: okay. Going back to this kind of prioritize piece and being able to influence and get people on board. I love the distinction that you have made in this term domestic emerging market because there's, I mean, there's a lot of terminology swirling around these issues, right?
[00:14:40] Apollo: E S G and impact investing and things like that. And I think you have a really distinct perspective on this that's probably informed by your kind of like, Go high level and then like work your way into an issue. Can you talk a little bit more about the distinction of domestic emerging market versus kind of some of the other ways that the founders and, and really the market that you're investing in is talked about?
[00:15:01] Danielle: Yeah. I think if, if you think about the US market, we think it's the most emerged market in the world, right? The greatest wealth power in the world, which is true. It is. Um, the US dollar still stands strong in that way for now, and, um, I, I think that to not get underneath that, to understand that there's several economies moving within a macro economy is why we haven't been able to crack the private equity vehicle open to be more diverse.
[00:15:27] Danielle: I mean, it, it's still. Very homogenous ventures. Incredibly homogenous in the fact of who has funds, run funds and is cutting checks. And then as a result of that, the people that are getting checks look like the people who are cutting checks, and it's one of the most exclusive environments in the country still.
[00:15:44] Danielle: So if you go like, why is that? The case. How can nearly 50% of your country be people of color? 70% of your country be women and people of color? And you still have an industry that completely looks different than the actual market does. Now, whenever that happens, you have to ask yourself, is capitalism gonna work in this case?
[00:16:00] Danielle: And I, I just fundamentally didn't think it is. I don't think the US, unless we figure this out, is gonna continue to be the greatest wealth power. I don't know how you can have 70% of your. Assets of the people that sit as a liability. Mm-hmm. On the US balance sheet. You know, if you're not investing in them and capitalizing them and they're not owning homes and all the data that's real, then you're not, your financial systems don't work the same way and money doesn't compound the same way.
[00:16:27] Danielle: So that's why I started the fund. It was more of this sort of macro economic view of uhoh, like we have to start making this investments and, and. When you look at a market that's been under invested in mm-hmm. And still has been able to make progress, it moves a certain way. So rather than have venture be the asset class that drives the way we invest, we have to look at the market and then find the asset class that best works for that.
[00:16:49] Danielle: Right. So this market moves like an emerging market. If I was investing in a. Hmm. Venezuelan economy right now, it's the same thing you're under invested in. You've got low hanging fruit, just getting financial systems operating and up and running and working lines of credit and ownership and equity is, is a multiplier.
[00:17:09] Danielle: You, you make a lot of money in emerging markets. But the other thing is emerging markets. Require patient capital take. Mm-hmm. They take a longer term investment and I just think all of that for me rings true when you talk about founders of color in the us
[00:17:22] Apollo: Mm. Yeah. Can you talk a little bit more about that balance sheet?
[00:17:27] Apollo: 'cause this is the thing you talk about, I think a lot about, about capitalism and the market's ability to solve problems, especially when it comes to things like, You know, social issues when it comes to climate, but, you know, if we were to break down just this, the social piece, I guess kind of, of the, the 70% right?
[00:17:47] Apollo: We're 70% that that figure that you're talking about is we're talking about women and people of color. Right?
[00:17:52] Danielle: Yep. That's 70% of your population and it's also 70% of the folks who aren't participating in financial systems in, in a normal way. So it's not all people of color, it's not all women. Mm-hmm.
[00:18:04] Danielle: Mm-hmm. Some, there's been some access, but we're talking 97% of private equity. Assets under management are not managed by people of color and women. So that's a huge number. It's your whole market. Right? And so you're saying they're not sitting on the part of the United States balance sheet? If you look at it like a rate volume exercise, there's such a small percentage of people who are contributing, who are making enough money to be paying significant enough taxes.
[00:18:33] Danielle: Whose money is in the market. If people's money is in the market, the market doesn't work. Mm-hmm. That's how the market works. You gimme some money and I go compound that for you. Mm-hmm. Interest rates. Mm-hmm. And investments. Mm-hmm. Um, that's how the market grows and becomes the greatest. So I think we've really backed ourself into a corner by not paying attention to this in the us, which is that you don't actually have enough people participating in the market to continue to be the greatest wealth.
[00:18:56] Danielle: Power. So access is the only tool you either tax the 1% who are. Paying enough, a lot more rate. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Or you get more volume, more people mm-hmm. That are paying taxes. I'm on the volume side. I'm a capitalist to my core. I believe the free market fixes things. The market's just not free Right now, it's actually quite exclusive.
[00:19:18] Danielle: Um, and, and capitalism isn't the problem despite political narratives on either side. Uh, of this, it's the way we're using capitalism and it's, it's the fact that it's never been a free market for everybody and therefore it's not growing. I don't know how you grow G D P if you don't get more people participating in having their businesses capitalized and grown and quickly.
[00:19:38] Apollo: I love it. So, I mean, as you're going in and you're getting your $4 million checks and you're getting also some like maybes and some nos and things like that, right? How much of. What you just said. Do your investors have to believe in order to cut the check? You know what I'm saying? Like how much of them believing in your thesis is dependent on them investing or, I mean, is it not really necessary that they believe what you believe?
[00:20:02] Apollo: Are you kind of selling them other aspects of, of the fund and what you're
[00:20:06] Danielle: doing? Uh, I think it is the reason I've been able to get $4 million checks. I just talk about this very differently. We go deep, I cut bigger checks than most early stage funds do. We go very deep with supports. We operate like a.
[00:20:18] Danielle: Private equity fund that's investing in startups, right? Mm-hmm. And even more and more. So I think that's gonna be the answer actually as we move forward, because these founders need more than a check, and they need a C F O when they need a C F O. Mm-hmm. They need help hiring a great sales person. I mean, it's the, all the fundamentals of business and that's how we approach it.
[00:20:40] Danielle: I don't, I don't wanna get a hundred million dollar valuations. I wanna create a hundred million dollar companies. Uh mm-hmm. And I think the a hundred million dollar valuation market, Is the problem. And so we wanna solve for that. And I think that because I've approached my thesis in that way, I think that's why we're getting $4 million checks.
[00:20:56] Danielle: I think it's so hard for people to raise money. It is so hard for people that look like us to raise money in this market. And I'm not super special. I think it's just, I have talked about it very differently and people wanna make it work and are listening to someone who's saying, Hey, let's just try something different.
[00:21:14] Apollo: Wow, that is badass. What she's saying is really big and bold. She's saying, yeah, we're a venture fund and we're gonna invest in startups, but we're gonna invest in startups like a private equity fund. We are going to not only financially invest, but we're also going to help them with operations to make sure that they can build really solid a hundred million dollar a year companies and not a hundred million dollar.
[00:21:38] Apollo: Valuations, which is a big distinction and it's really controversial, honestly, to go in front of investors and say that you're gonna do this, but this is how she's been getting investors to commit. The thing that's even more remarkable about this is, I know a secret about Danielle, she. Is a recovering people pleaser.
[00:22:02] Apollo: I mean, you have this stack of accolades, not to mention that you have a kid in college and another one on the way. Yeah. And when I was out there in Colorado meeting you for the very first time, we were having some really personal conversations, and one of the things that you said that has really transformed things, and I guess this would've been around 18 months ago now, is you talked about this light bulb that went off for you around people pleasing.
[00:22:27] Apollo: And not being a people pleaser. And it's just, it's interesting to see, again, see these like this stack of stack of accolades, all the things that you've done both personally and professionally in your life. And saying that, you know, feeling like up until 18 months ago, this kind of people pleasing tendency had a grip on, on a lot of things that you did.
[00:22:46] Apollo: Can you talk about like how and why that changed and what the impact has been there?
[00:22:51] Danielle: Yeah, it was, I think this is for any entrepreneur, it doesn't necessarily have to be people pleasing, but it's life. Like life shapes us and we navigate life in the ways we were taught to by our environments. And for me, it was certainly that.
[00:23:03] Danielle: It was certainly codependency and people pleasing. And I was so motivated in my career by just wanting to make everybody happy and it worked out really well for me in a resume or on paper. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And I think, um, when I went out on my own, like I lost my fuel source, And it was really hard. Mm. I didn't, that's how I knew.
[00:23:21] Danielle: I'm like, oh, like why am I not motivated in the same way? I'm like, I work my butt off. I've always worked my butt off. And so I was like, how do I get back to that where I wanna do it for myself? And I couldn't, like, I really had to confront in myself that I was always doing it for other people. And it's why I never felt satisfied either.
[00:23:41] Danielle: It's why like the resume is so stacked. But I was like, I felt successful, but I never felt satisfied. I was never content, there was always just this boil of discontent in me, and I think part of that was that I, I, I always was like able to get myself up because of. Other people and what they expected of me and to not wanna disappoint anybody.
[00:24:03] Danielle: And so it's interesting. It's never gonna go away in me 'cause it's so part of who I am now. Mm-hmm. I'm better. But I also sort of use it to hack myself as, as somebody who's got a lot of responsibility right now and who has to keep moving even when I don't want to. And how does that hack work? You know, for me, I hired faster than I.
[00:24:24] Danielle: Needed to because being responsible for those payrolls and for a team and people I really cared about and their families is been the motivating source when I can't do that even for myself. That's amazing. Mm-hmm. That's amazing. I'm sure it's different for everyone, but I had to figure out how to get back.
[00:24:44] Danielle: To where I had to use this thing against myself a little bit, uh, in order to just fuel this journey. 'cause it's so hard. It's so hard. I mean, entrepreneurship is hard. Raising a fund is. The most insane thing I've
[00:24:57] Apollo: ever done
[00:25:01] Apollo: Kid in college and another one on the way. And the fund was the most insane thing
[00:25:05] Danielle: that she's ever done. Uh, totally. Yeah. That was easy compared honestly.
[00:25:11] Apollo: Oh man. As the parent of a one year old and a four year old, that is not what I want to hear right now. Um, um, that's so interesting that. You had that level of self-awareness to say like, okay, I need to hack myself in this way.
[00:25:26] Apollo: And I guess that's a big offset of that, that low execution, right? Because like there are a lot of people who have high execution scores and they love doing stuff just for the sake of being able to cross it off their list. Right. Just for, mm-hmm. The pride in building subject matter expertise and being able to like step back and be like, Hey, look, I stacked all these bricks in this place.
[00:25:46] Apollo: Like, that's, that's a thing for some people. But for you, that was never really the motivator of like having a checklist of things crossed off. It was, it was impact. And then when you moved into your own entrepreneurial space, you had to find a way. To keep that motivation. Right. And so you pulled that people lever to be able to do that.
[00:26:06] Apollo: Can you tell, tell me a little bit about how, so you, you recognized, okay, you know what, I'm gonna have to leverage other people here to help fuel my motivation. But you al also have a very hands-on approach to supporting the companies that you invest in. Right. Can you tell me a little bit about how you went about the process of hiring?
[00:26:27] Danielle: So the one thing I did was I cut a big check and hired a second managing director pretty immediately, um, which is incredibly rare. So it was before I had, you know, raised a first 2 million or anything, right? Mm-hmm. And so, It was, it forced me to be really creative and it forced me to put like my money where my mouth was, around us being a fund that was gonna really get to know our portfolio companies and our investments and really be a partner with them.
[00:26:54] Danielle: And, um, I had to go raise the capital to be able to support that and myself. And most people that start funds are independently wealthy, so that's why it works for them and why it doesn't work for us. 'cause we have to go raise every dollar and that's how you, you know, your assets under management mm-hmm.
[00:27:08] Danielle: Is how you get paid. Mm-hmm. It forced me to get really creative so that I could show up. And then I hired my chief of staff. Um, she worked for me before right away too, because she's my executor. So it was just a matter of. Saying, I know what I'm good at, what I'm not good at. I'd rather have the pressure of making sure their payroll hits every month than the pressure of trying to execute all the details of building this fund by myself.
[00:27:35] Danielle: Like I knew which one I would be better at. That's so big, and it's definitely the fundraising that's so big. I don't love it, but I'm better at it than I would've been. The other things.
[00:27:45] Apollo: You know, it's, I feel like the thing that you're hitting on right now is part of what keeps that balance sheet out of whack, and that is all of the barriers for moving into entrepreneurship, especially for, for people of color and women, and especially women of color.
[00:28:02] Apollo: I was at an event at my alma mater at U S C and I spoke, and then afterwards, um, a couple of of women who had just graduated from Master's programs, uh, were asking me questions about consulting and things like that, and they're like, oh man, I feel like I really want to consult, but. I feel like I'm not gonna be taken seriously.
[00:28:23] Apollo: I feel like I'm not gonna have the credibility and maybe I'm not even ready. Should I go get a PhD in such and such and such and such so that people will Yeah, exactly. You cringe, right? Yeah. And it's just like this thing that people of color, it's like, I think you either have that execute thing so hard.
[00:28:40] Apollo: That it's hard to think about being an entrepreneur because you've just been thinking about checking all these boxes so that way you can get the next thing on the resume, right? Or that next degree or that next certification or that next title, that next raise. That thinking about entrepreneurship feels totally foreign.
[00:28:55] Apollo: Right? Or feeling like I'll, I'll do it when I'm qualified. Right? Like, how'd you not get stuck there?
[00:29:04] Danielle: You know, I probably should have done this a long time ago, knowing myself, so I'm, I'm a builder and I'm not a, like, I'll build the will and as soon as it's ready to get turned, it's, I should hand it off. So I, I have that in me, but I held myself back, right.
[00:29:17] Danielle: Which made me disruptive in corporate America, you can imagine. Mm-hmm. Because like mm-hmm. Unless you're giving me a new job every two years, then I get bored and I'm like, I'll break the wheel just so that I have something to rebuild and something fun to do. And so then I, I kept hitting that, that sort of like, every two years I'm like shaking too much stuff up and, you know, it gets a little hard on my interpersonal relationships in my career.
[00:29:41] Danielle: So that's when I really hit the wall where I was like, I, I should be out on my own. And I had an executive coach who just said that, she's like, it's ridiculous that you keep. Working for people. Um, but it's also terrifying. It's also terrifying not to, it's like we don't have that sort of backup plan if it doesn't work and, and, you know, We're taking care of our families and women of color are the most educated demographic in the country.
[00:30:07] Danielle: Black women are the most educated demographic in the country right now, and they're the most undercapitalized in every single way. Pay equity, they're businesses being able to buy homes. So like, it's not, it's not us, it's, it's not, you need three more degrees, but I understand mm-hmm. That the system told us to do that.
[00:30:26] Danielle: And one thing that I think is the great equalizer, Is that anyone that starts this, even someone who has a cushion and can, you know, pay their own salary. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Or is independently wealthy, like they have different fears, but the fear is still there and you can't actually say it's less scary for white guys than it is for us because.
[00:30:47] Danielle: It's all perspective. Right, right. Yeah. It's scary. Yeah. Whether I think I'd be afraid if I had all that working in my favor. Mm-hmm. Maybe I wouldn't, but I, it doesn't mean they don't. So I think that's the thing is that it's just, it's a jump. It's a leap of absolute faith. And if you have not done your own work, this thing gets nearly impossible.
[00:31:10] Danielle: Like if you haven't done the work on yourself. Yeah. And you don't understand who you are and you don't believe. That you have the ability to do this, it, it just becomes impossible. It's super hard. Yeah.
[00:31:22] Apollo: Well, I mean, but even that, it's, there's so much nuance there, right? Because I think, okay, you can look at how is it that these other funds, these kind of traditional funds, are able to go out and fundraise and you are able to.
[00:31:36] Apollo: Simulate some of those conditions around your fund, right? Because you rose specifically a separate pot of money just to build out the organization and support your portfolio companies, right?
[00:31:47] Danielle: Yeah, so we raised, um, like philanthropic operating capital, so grants in the beginning, about 2 million just to get the funds started so that we were, you know, I was able to pay myself.
[00:31:57] Danielle: I was able to pay a team, just get that stuff going. Mm-hmm. So that you actually can go out and raise money. Right. Like, that's missing. Like, people don't have that. They don't have access. It costs me a million and a half dollars to start this fund, and nobody says anything like that. No one's telling anyone that.
[00:32:12] Danielle: Hmm. Mm-hmm. So whether it be, I don't, I have a million and a half dollars myself, or I don't need to pay myself for anyone, we can all work for free for a year. Yeah. Which is the same thing as a million dollars, right? For a bunch of
[00:32:24] Apollo: that, that, that are, that you can get to 1.5 really quickly.
[00:32:27] Danielle: Right. That's it.
[00:32:28] Danielle: That's like what happens. Um, or you can raise money so fast from your friends to get assets under management that mm-hmm. You can start paying yourself immediately. Like that's the only three entry points. Mm-hmm. Like, that's it. And no one's saying that. Right. And so all these people can't raise money and then it, they, it, it becomes this, it's me, it's personal, like, and then people give up and that makes me really sad 'cause I have never seen a system more designed for failure then this one.
[00:32:54] Danielle: Mm-hmm. Unless you're wealthy. The people that make money here are people that have money.
[00:32:58] Apollo: Danielle just called out the hidden challenges of starting a fund. She said, you need $1.5 million to start a fund, and no one tells you that. What do you need that money for to actually do the work while not getting paid by anybody else?
[00:33:12] Apollo: So you have to either have the $1.5 million in the first place, or be in a financial position where you and your team don't need the money to work, or be in a position where you can raise so much money so fast that you get the assets under management that are gonna. Pay you the fees to sustain yourself and your team.
[00:33:31] Apollo: Or you could be like, Brian Hollins our guest from episode number five of this podcast and work a job while also raising and running a scout fund. Regardless of how you do it, it's challenging. Add being a person of color or a woman to that, and it gets even more difficult. So I'm really curious how in one breath, Danielle can talk about how these challenges that seem to be baked into the system, but then in the next breath she can say that capitalism is the answer and is the way out.
[00:34:05] Apollo: I had to ask her how she reconciles those two perspectives.
[00:34:09] Danielle: Yeah, on a macro level, capitalism is an economic policy, right? It's the way in which you run your economy and that businesses will solve problems and create a middle class, which we used to have the greatest middle class in the world. Like all of that stuff is really important for a solid economy.
[00:34:29] Danielle: So I believe in it. I believe in business. I believe in the human condition. I believe in the mind. And people's ability to solve problems. Um, I think the government moves slow. I wouldn't have them come solve any of my personal problems. And I've worked as a C F O in the government. So I'm saying that as an insider and an outsider and someone who's collect data over time.
[00:34:49] Danielle: And so that's what I mean. But also the entire economic policy is redlined for certain people to not participate. So one condition can exist and so can the other. And if we unread line capitalism, And have capitalism work the way it's intended to, then capitalism would not be the problem. Right? But if we don't like open the hood and say, this policy, it's capitalism.
[00:35:17] Danielle: Venture capital is capitalism all day, right? But within it, the implementation of it makes it very impossible for folks to enter into this to get it done. So people aren't participating in capitalism. So if I can't even get in, Then capitalism isn't the problem. It's the way we've redlined it. It's the way we've implemented it.
[00:35:36] Danielle: I mean, women couldn't sign their own mortgages until the seventies. That's a redlined policy. Mm-hmm. To create a disparity in the economics of capitalism. Mm-hmm. Capitalism isn't the issue. People figured out how to cast system through capitalism on who can access what and who can make what work for them.
[00:35:54] Danielle: So both, I just hold both truths. 'cause I think that's that's what it is and it's the only thing that would keep me going because. You know, otherwise you just have to start over. And I don't, I don't think that's gonna happen, but I do think we can love unwind, unwind policy and build new ways forward.
[00:36:10] Apollo: Yeah, there's that pragmatic element. I love it. The other question that's kicking me in the back of the brain is another kind of paradoxical set of circumstances that you laid out, and that is this, identifying the balance and believing in yourself and also, Understanding your limitations and, and kind of plugging those gaps, right?
[00:36:34] Apollo: Because you're like, Hey, believe in yourself. And then you did a thing you said almost nobody does in hiring another managing director, right, right off the bat. And there are certain ways that if you kind of like hold that decision up. It could be really hard to make that decision if the narrative that you needed to be able to cross over into entrepreneurship is like, believe in yourself, believe in yourself.
[00:36:58] Apollo: You got this, you got this, you got this. And immediately hire a senior level person for help. Like how did you walk that line and how do you suggest other people find the way to, to walk that line? 'cause it's clearly worked for you.
[00:37:10] Danielle: Yeah, I mean, I think it's really important. I believe in myself and I am a unique individual and we all are right, but you can't believe in yourself if you don't know yourself.
[00:37:22] Danielle: And that's what, like, I don't, I do not believe in myself to get things done by myself. Don't do it. Like if that's me, if that's what's required, I would never have the confidence to do it. If someone's like, you're gonna have to do that thing, and it'll be by yourself, because I know myself so well, I'm like, I'm not doing that thing, I'm not taking that risk.
[00:37:40] Danielle: It's too risky. Can't, like I, you're, I'm betting more than I can lose on that because I won't do it. So you yourself. Is yourself. It's like, what do you know to be true about yourself? I'm gonna get up outta bed and take a hundred hours of meetings a week to make sure I make payroll for my team. Right?
[00:37:59] Danielle: That's me. Right? So I have to have a team to do that for. I love it. That's where I'm at my best. Like I. Basically put myself into a corner, but that's a, that's me. That's not every, some people fold. When you get put into a corner like that, that kind of pressure doesn't fuel you. It cripples you. So if you don't know that about yourself, like what's the next best thing in order to believe in yourself and what you are good at, then I think then you won't be able to actually believe in yourself.
[00:38:26] Danielle: You'll have some, mm-hmm. Existential, structural. Way in which that actually supposed to show up. Like it's this fake competence thing and what does competence look like? Yeah. I don't know. It looks different than all of us.
[00:38:41] Apollo: Yeah. If you had to venture what the next evolution of yourself looks like, like you were able to again, make the leap and say, Hey, I'm Audi.
[00:38:53] Apollo: You're gonna start your own thing, but then like realizing that this was gonna get you outta bed of having a team to support and going out and fundraising. You know, do you feel like this is sustainable? Can you live here in terms of all the things that you wanna accomplish? Or do you think that there's a, a future evolution that you have to strive for?
[00:39:10] Apollo: And what, what might that look like?
[00:39:13] Danielle: Nothing I do is, um, sustainable because I know myself. So I've got a few years of runway. I'll build the thing and then I will bring in people to turn the wheel of this thing that's already working, because it'll be time for me to tackle the next thing that's on fire like I'm a firefighter.
[00:39:29] Danielle: I think if, if, you know, you had to summarize what I think I do for a living, um, that's the title I'd give myself and I finally know that and just like let myself. I think that way, I'm not looking for the job or the thing that's gonna be 20 years long for myself because that would just be operating outside who I am, and I'm done being hard on myself about that.
[00:39:53] Danielle: So it's like, all right, what's the next fire? What's the next way to bend this system towards justice? What policy work needs to happen? And I'll do that.
[00:40:03] Apollo: I love it. At the end of the show, we do these takeaways and if there was one big takeaway that I feel like people should walk away with, it's like you can be a prioritizer and be a firefighter at the priority level like you are fighting fires.
[00:40:20] Apollo: But like, they look like fires to you, but like to us, they just look like a bunch of dry leaves, but you're like, no, no, no. Those dry leaves are gonna catch fire. Yeah, exactly. And that's, that's really cool because most of the time when you find people who are kind of firefighters, it's at the execute level and there has to be an active fire that they are battling against.
[00:40:40] Apollo: But I love that you're a prioritized level firefighter. That's that's awesome.
[00:40:45] Danielle: Yeah, I run towards the smoke, like, oh, there's smoke coming from that thing. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Is there a way for us to get in front of it a little bit?
[00:40:54] Apollo: I love it. Well, thank you so much for your time and for the great conversation as usual.
[00:41:00] Danielle: Yeah, you too. Thanks for having me.
[00:41:04] Apollo: All right, friends, it's the end of the interview. You know what that means. Time for some takeaways. As far as prioritizing goes, Danielle says that it is, So key to believe in yourself. Not only that, but to believe in your own opinion, to have an opinion about the way things work and don't.
[00:41:25] Apollo: She has a really unique perspective on macroeconomics and fundraising and venture capital and private equity, and she uses that opinion to create a unique. Competitive advantage and stand out from the crowd. So from that prioritized perspective, she says, don't be pressured to follow norms. As far as leverage goes, Danielle says that you should know what people's strengths are, including your own.
[00:41:53] Apollo: She knows that she has a people pleaser tendency, and that's why she hired fast, not only to onboard these skills and talents and brains. But also because she knew that she would be held accountable to going out and doing what she needed to do to grow the business. She also leveraged structures. So going back to that, having an opinion about how things work and don't work, she didn't recreate the wheel.
[00:42:20] Apollo: She just used the venture model, but is taking a private equity approach. So don't feel like you have to reinvent the wheel, use what's already working and just tweak it to your unique competitive advantage. And finally, as far as execute goes, she says you gotta know how to get things done, how things work, and how to complete checklists.
[00:42:42] Apollo: Thank you all so much for listening, and a huge thanks. To our guest, Danielle Shoots, we will see you all on the mountain. Remember, you can find out what your achievement index is by going to www.achievementindexdo.com. Take the assessment, takes about 15, 20 minutes. Make sure you're in a nice, calm state of mind and a quiet place, and you can find out your own achievement index and figure out.
[00:43:13] Apollo: How you match up against our guests. I'm Dr. Apollo Omeka. If you like the podcast, please rate us on whatever platform you're listening and remember to share it with your friends. Thanks. See you next time.
[00:43:28] Apollo: I.